[vigge_sWe]

Originally Posted by ichwar

Nono, :D
You need to go back a couple of pages and read the conversation between zen-r and I.
Edit:

I like the way you kept trying and trying and trying to close firefox before you finally stopped the video. :D
Those were some of the little frustrations that helped to scare me away from windos.

Nah, it was a bug in camstudio, that you needed to go to it from the tray area. I never pressed minimize on the window, as I didn't want to show my desktop as I have sometimes things on it that should not be mentioned here xD (Not porn, torrents xD)

[zen-r]

I was more concerned by the "murderturtle.gif" on your desktop!


Edit : and this must be it ; http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0aTAX855-1s


Warning Everyone: Could this be a sign that vigge is secretly training a ruthless army of killer turtles? Is this a cunning part of his evil plan for world domination?!

[vigge_sWe]

http://bitsandpieces.us/wp-content/u...rderturtle.gif

[xav0989]

You were right zen, it was the serial killer turtle. We need to watch our backs, a turtle could show up at any moment!

[ichwar]

If that turtle could destroy something that flies, I'm sure it wouldn't be too hard for him to annihilate something that doesn't even run, like windos! :D

[xav0989]

good one there, I have to admit it.

[xmaverick]

I'm not jealous of Compiz-Fusion for Linux because I've found it really **** and a turtle against Aero. But, more important, as a developer, I've developed for years on linux kernel and on Windows. The one thing that no one knows is that WPF Api's on Windows can make the so loved Beryls effect on every windows that want to implement them. Here the source:

http://code.msdn.microsoft.com/wpf3dcubewindow

Simply, as a thing that can do only an OS with WPF (XP with .NET 3.5 or Vista), business developers simply don't spend time (aka money, because of the equation time = money) to do these fancy effect. I've done by myself just because I like to do software at home, but at work no things like these required. Ad, of course, if you want to do something on the desktop, just pass the handle of the main desktop window (really, I remember 0) to the API's so you will modify your windows. And It's free, no more packets or windows manager like Compiz. Just the API of the Operating System.
As if you google, you will find much more examples and things that people done, like Bitmaps Alpha Maps to really shape a GUI object, and so more.
http://www.creativeui.com/category/wpfsilverlight/

I think the only API that come NEAR Wpf is Cocoa, but it's a Mac Experience, not a Linux experience.

As for Linux is unhackerable, Secunia know near 314 exploit to write malevolent software on linux kernel 2.6.xx, against 64 know exploit against vista kernel.

And about Mobile 6.5, if you like the GUI of your iPhone, just install on Mobile iFonz (http://allaboutpda.wordpress.com/200...-088-29022008/). With the difference that if you want to change it or reverse back, you can. On the iPhone, you can get only what bigA wants.
Edit:
Ah I forgot. Also Eclipse belong to windows And so on MySQL, KDE (yes, also KDE 4.2.2 is available for Windows!), QT, GTK, Netbeans, and so on. Simpli, near 99% of free source software runs on near all operating systems, so Open Source is not an exclusive of Linux.

On the multitasking and multiuser, OS/2 (developed by Microsoft and IBM) still had multitasking and multiuser experince. Then Microsoft (at these times they got Xenix UNIX distro: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xenix. You cannot realize that M$ done a piece of story of Unix, isn't it? ) just moved from IBM and OS and start developing Windows NT and Windows 3.11. The first for server purpose, the second for home and clients. The first had always multiuser and multitasking, on home, for multiuser experinge we have waited for Win95

So, Linux is funny. If you have time to play :D :D :D :D (because as a unix, is only a toy against BSD, HP-UNIX and Solaris. As a desktop enviroment, is only a toy against Windows and Mac).

[debio264]

/me changes to his Linux user hat...

Originally Posted by xmaverick

I think the only API that come NEAR Wpf is Cocoa, but it's a Mac Experience, not a Linux experience.

And yet the general industry concensus is that most Microsoft APIs are pure misery to write code for, and thus there are all sorts of layered abstractions to keep the poor programmer away from them.
I don't doubt that it's possible to have Compiz-like functionality on Windows, but the sad truth is that Linux has Compiz, which is fast and stable (unless you have crappy graphics drivers) and Windows doesn't. Aero is Microsoft's attempt to catch up, and I doubt they'll lag behind for long.

Originally Posted by xmaverick

As for Linux is unhackerable, Secunia know near 314 exploit to write malevolent software on linux kernel 2.6.xx, against 64 know exploit against vista kernel.

That would actually have a good bit of meaning except when you consider that Linux exploits are reported to public mailing lists and are thus easily tracked, whereas any Microsoft exploit is pretty much only known once Microsoft releases a patch for it and writes a KB. If they put multiple exploit fixes into a patch or never release a patch, no one really knows.
If nothing else, the difference I see is that with Linux, to be exploited in any way, you pretty much have to download an infected binary and explicitly run it with superuser privileges, which simply doesn't happen. With Windows, the door tends to be much more open.

Originally Posted by xmaverick

Ah I forgot. Also Eclipse belong to windows And so on MySQL, KDE (yes, also KDE 4.2.2 is available for Windows!), QT, GTK, Netbeans, and so on. Simpli, near 99% of free source software runs on near all operating systems, so Open Source is not an exclusive of Linux.

Open Source projects have been branching to OSs besides Linux because Open Source programmers have started porting their code to the other OSs. QT, GTK, and all that were developed on Linux and ported later. Any interoperability is there because the originally Linux developer base decided additional platforms would be good to support. This is also where we get things like coLinux, Cygwin, and MinGW.
Linux is still the home of open source development; that's why Ubuntu can get away with requiring GPL or LGPL licensing on every piece of software installed on a normal system. That's why I can get an entire OS for free instead of paying for a Windows license and an Office license. Don't even get me started on enterprise licensing.

Originally Posted by xmaverick

So, Linux is funny. If you have time to play :D :D :D :D (because as a unix, is only a toy against BSD, HP-UNIX and Solaris. As a desktop enviroment, is only a toy against Windows and Mac).

Then why is it standard on any VPS or dedicated server host anywhere? Why do x10 and most other web hosts run it? Why has the Ubuntu distribution alone outdone Unix as a desktop OS? Why is Linux adoption accelerating to the point that computer manufacturers will ship Ubuntu as a preinstalled OS if the user wants it?

This "toy" seems to be more than you think.

[xmaverick]

Originally Posted by debio264

/me changes to his Linux user hat...


And yet the general industry concensus is that most Microsoft APIs are pure misery to write code for, and thus there are all sorts of layered abstractions to keep the poor programmer away from them.
I don't doubt that it's possible to have Compiz-like functionality on Windows, but the sad truth is that Linux has Compiz, which is fast and stable (unless you have crappy graphics drivers) and Windows doesn't. Aero is Microsoft's attempt to catch up, and I doubt they'll lag behind for long.

Aero comed first. And still is stable and not crappy, instead of Compiz that is stable only on ubuntu. I've tryed it on Red Hat 5 Enterprise and was a bunch of crap to install it, and I've done some hard C work to modify some libraries that doesn't want to compile with it.

Originally Posted by debio264

That would actually have a good bit of meaning except when you consider that Linux exploits are reported to public mailing lists and are thus easily tracked, whereas any Microsoft exploit is pretty much only known once Microsoft releases a patch for it and writes a KB. If they put multiple exploit fixes into a patch or never release a patch, no one really knows.
If nothing else, the difference I see is that with Linux, to be exploited in any way, you pretty much have to download an infected binary and explicitly run it with superuser privileges, which simply doesn't happen. With Windows, the door tends to be much more open.

Not an objective reply. Data simply shows that Vista is secure as unix (minus MacOS that is the worst secure system).

As you can see here: http://dvlabs.tippingpoint.com/blog/...ay-and-wrap-up

Ubuntu was not exploited, it's right, but Vista was exploited using an Adobe Reader 0-day exploit. That means 3rth party software problems, that is not directly involved in kernel ops. Ubuntu doesn't suffer of this exploit just because doesn't run Adobe Reader or Adobe Flash, using an open-source (but with less functionality) component. Same exploit used for vista was used later to exploit (and this is funny) Nintendo Wii. Now the hole is patched.
And maybe, the thing that the whole world knows and hole, can be a problem to administrat that by some way cannot upgrade systems (upgrade the kernel on a linux distro maybe not be a safe operation in enterprise business because can create upredictable events, just think that VMWare Server 2.0 have issues with Ubuntu 9.04).

Originally Posted by debio264

Open Source projects have been branching to OSs besides Linux because Open Source programmers have started porting their code to the other OSs. QT, GTK, and all that were developed on Linux and ported later. Any interoperability is there because the originally Linux developer base decided additional platforms would be good to support. This is also where we get things like coLinux, Cygwin, and MinGW.
Linux is still the home of open source development; that's why Ubuntu can get away with requiring GPL or LGPL licensing on every piece of software installed on a normal system. That's why I can get an entire OS for free instead of paying for a Windows license and an Office license. Don't even get me started on enterprise licensing.

Incorrect. Open source was not started with linux, but with ScoUNIX / BSD, and much more. GNU used Linux as the kernel for his systems just becase HURD was not ready (and still not ready).

Originally Posted by debio264

Then why is it standard on any VPS or dedicated server host anywhere? Why do x10 and most other web hosts run it? Why has the Ubuntu distribution alone outdone Unix as a desktop OS? Why is Linux adoption accelerating to the point that computer manufacturers will ship Ubuntu as a preinstalled OS if the user wants it?

A commercial licence of Red Hat 5 Enterprise costs near 700 €. A commercial licence of Red Hat 5 Desktop costs near 200 €. And, no, you cannot use for work things like ubuntu because it have a lot of kernel modification that make it uncompatible with all other distros, as just os SuSE. The business standard is Red Hat, we all know, but isn't free at all. You can use Fedora, but deliberatly doesn't have all the tool (clustering, for example) that Red Hat 5 Enterprise have. If you don't pay for a licence you can still install him if you can find the DVD, but the system will not upgrade at all until you doesn't provide a regular licence ID.

About the UI, the general performance of the graphic subsystem by Windows is really better.

http://widefox.pbworks.com/Graphics

(The only wrong thing in this tests is that if you use WPF you have also layered and modular subsystem).

But now we're going OT, and this can be discussed on technical forums.
But you can do at least at the same things Linux can do on Vista, so we can replace Beryl with some other Open Source component written for WPF. Simply, who have the patience and the time to do this?

[vigge_sWe]

Originally Posted by xmaverick

we can replace Beryl with some other Open Source component written for WPF. Simply, who have the patience and the time to do this?

There is a lot of programs out there that implements things from linux into windows. I already seen multiple desktops and 3D cube for windows on sourceforge.